1132CU not dimming

Posted on
Thu Jun 24, 2004 3:21 pm
AJV offline

1132CU not dimming

I'm using Indigo 1.5 to upload commands the 1132CU to control a lamp module (generic magnavox).

I have two timed actions spaced about 2 minutes apart:
1. Turn device on
2. Dim by 60%

I have tested both commands using Indigo (via the "Execute Action Now") button and they work fine. However, once I have uploaded the commands to the 1132CU, the lamp is only turned on, not dimmed.

According to the upload compatibility report, these commands are "good"
(I set the device to "Lamp Module" with "supports dimming: normal").

I've been testing this for a few days on a couple of devices so I find it unlikely that the "dim" commands are getting corrupted by random noise.

Anyone have any ideas on what is (not) happening? Thanks.

Posted on
Thu Jun 24, 2004 4:32 pm
matt (support) offline
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Re: 1132CU not dimming

From what I can tell, we have an unfortunate intersection of hardware features and module anomalies occuring. This a bit complicated, but here are some details:

1132CU hardware characteristic: The 1132CU, when it is working in stand-alone mode, does not know or track the current brightness state of devices. Indigo, when it is controlling your logic, does track the current brightness state.

Types of dimming (Absolute vs. Relative): There are two different techniques to do dimming: one relative (by %), one absolute (set to %). The LampLinc, SwitchLinc, ToggleLinc, and some of the Leviton modules all support absolute dimming (referred to as preset or extended dimming). Absolute dimming is much more accurate than relative dimming. X10 signal problems can seriously mess up how accurate relative dimming is, for example. When you do a "dim by %" from within Indigo, Indigo is smart enough to always use absolute dimming if the module supports it, even though you requested a relative dim. Indigo can do this because it tracks the brightness state of the light. For example, say your light is at 75% and you have an action that does a dim down 10%. Instead of sending a relative 10% dim to the module, Indigo will send a more accurate absolute dim of 65%.

The gotcha is, the PowerLinc USB cannot do this more complex but accurate logic. Because of this, you will notice, especially if the X10 signal path isn't excellent, that relative dimming is not accurate.

SwitchLinc/LampLinc/ToggleLinc dimming: Lastly, it seems that the *Linc line of modules does not respond to normal (non-preset) dims the same as generic X10 modules. So when the 1132CU sends out a normal relative dim command, a SwitchLinc will respond to a lesser degree (much lesser) than a generic X10 module. I've verified this using a non-1132 controller as well -- this isn't a problem with the 1132CU sending the dims, but the SwitchLine modules barely dim at all in response to the commands. Normally, if you are using Indigo to control the logic you won't see this because only absolute preset dims will be used, which the SwitchLinc handles fine.

So now what? If you can change your logic to instead send an absolute dim (use a "Set Brightness" Action instead of a "Dim by %" or "Brighten by %" Action), then it should work better because the 1132CU will always send preset dims. Of course, this may not be possible depending on what you are doing. I'm going to investigate artificially increasing the number of dim/brightens sent by the 1132CU when the module receiving them is defined as a SwitchLinc (or LampLinc) module. I'm not thrilled about doing this because it might have unwanted consequences, but I'll at least look into it.

Regards,
Matt

Posted on
Thu Jun 24, 2004 4:45 pm
Guest offline

(No subject)

Matt,

Thanks for the detailed reply. I will adjust the logic as per your suggestion and will let you know how well it works.

For what it's worth, I was previously using the Thinking Home software for an ActiveHome CM11a controller (via USB to serial port adapters, ughh!) and everything worked fine. I double-checked the logic for that configuration and it was using "Dim To" not "Dim By".

Cheers...ajv

Posted on
Thu Jun 24, 2004 5:12 pm
matt (support) offline
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I posted a new beta build that sends more dims and brightens:

http://www.perceptiveautomation.com/ind ... o_beta.dmg

It still isn't as accurate as absolute dimming and it can take a long time to send all the data on the power line, but it seems a bit better. I still recommend using absolute dimming whenever possible (use a "Set Brightness" Action instead of a "Dim by %" or "Brighten by %" Action).

Regards,
Matt

Posted on
Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:15 pm
AJV offline

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Well...I changed the logic to set "Brightness To" rather "Dim By", tested it for a few days: still no dimming.

For whatever reason, the dimming is not happening. I haven't had time to test the logic changed fully (e.g., send it a series of set "Brightness To" commands to see if really is an issue with some of those commands getting "squashed" by noise, but all "Turn On" and Turn Off" commands on many devices have been functioning fine: only dimming seems to be an issue).

I will try the "many commands in a series" experiment soon to see if the lamp module will ever dim.

Posted on
Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:15 pm
matt (support) offline
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(No subject)

I've posted a new beta build with further improvements in how brightens and dims are sent from the PowerLinc Controller:

http://www.perceptiveautomation.com/ind ... o_beta.dmg

Regards,
Matt

Posted on
Fri Jul 16, 2004 3:49 pm
TOMinMN offline
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1132CU Not Dimming - 1.5.2 Almost There

Matt,

The v.1.5.2 software improves the dimming capability of the 1132CU on generic lamp and wall switch modules, but I think it overshoots a bit judging from the little opportunity I've had to play with it. Your mission, should you choose to accept it, would be to calibrate the on-line and off-line "dim by xx%" to each other. I think that's what your customers who have come over from the MouseHouse/CM11A camp would expect.

Thanks, Tom

Posted on
Fri Jul 16, 2004 4:25 pm
matt (support) offline
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Re: 1132CU Not Dimming - 1.5.2 Almost There

Oh sure, first it was too little and now it is too much. Some people are just so hard to please. :lol:

Seriously, part of the problem is that different module brands (Smarthome, Leviton, PCS, X10) seem to respond to the relative dim commands to varying degrees. I'll look into this some more. Additionally, the timing between relative dims is slower when the 1132CU sends them itself, compared to when Indigo sends them, which further complicates everything. Sounds like I'll have to play with all the different module types and see how many dims it takes to go from 100% to 0% for each one. Eak.

Regards,
Matt

Posted on
Thu Jul 29, 2004 1:07 pm
kendals offline
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Joined: May 24, 2004

this is happening for me to running v1.52

I upgraded to 1.52 indigo and it is still not dimming for me either. I have a 1132CU unit and it worked fine when I had my CM11A unit, but I wanted to go the USB route, but I might have to go back if I cannot get this to work. Any ideas?

thanks

Scott

Posted on
Thu Jul 29, 2004 1:50 pm
matt (support) offline
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Re: this is happening for me to running v1.52

Hi Scott,

Can you describe the behavior you are seeing -- does it manually dim/brighten okay (when "online" with the interface) and only fail when uploaded to the 1132CU? How does it fail -- does it do nothing at all? Do On/Off commands work okay? What type of modules are you trying to dim?

Matt

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