Controlling 3-way switch circuits

I have just replaced two existing 3-way switches with one INSTEON SwitchLinc V2 and one ICON Dimmer. They were installed in accordance with the INSTEON/ICON user manuals and "cross-linked" as described so that either switch properly (at least, manually) controls the lights. The junction box, into which the incoming power line entered, dictated that the ICON Dimmer was installed as the "primary" and the SwitchLinc V2 as the "secondary". Everything seems to be fine ... sort of.

I could NOT create a new device for the ICON Dimmer in Indigo v1.8 beta 6. Okay ... I thought ... and neither would an event turn on the lights. I selected the SwitchLinc as the device to control (because at that time it didn't like the ICON Dimmer) ... the SwitchLinc V2's LEDs would "ramp up" but the lights did not turn on.

Today, I downloaded/installed Indigo v1.8 beta 9 and the ICON was recognized as a new device without a hitch. I switched the device to be controlled to the ICON Dimmer and the lights seem to be under Indigo control as intended! The ONLY issue seems to be that when Indigo turns on the lights, the SwitchLinc V2 LEDs do NOT show the light as being on ... but they ARE.

Bottom line ... are the SwitchLinc V2 LEDs not coming on because it is the "secondary" (by INSTEON terminology) switch in the circuit and Indigo is ONLY controlling the ICON Dimmer? Can Indigo ONLY be set up to control the "primary" device in a multi-way circuit?

Skip

I have a similar problem, however I am not using any Icon switches. When I attempt to turn on the primary switch through Indigo, the status indicator lights go up, but the lights don't turn on. If I tell Indigo to do a status check, it reports that the lights are on at 100% even though they are off. The secondary switch works perfectly. If I turn the primary switch on manually, Indigo receives the message and shows the correct status. It also reports the correct status of the secondary switch. I have been using Beta 8, but will download Beta 9 to see if this addresses any of these problems.

[matt (support)]

The switches are linked to each other, but Indigo sends direct (not linked group) commands to control the switches. This means when you tell the primary switch (the one with the load attached) to turn on, the secondary switch doesn't know to update its LED ramp. You have a couple of options: you could create an Action Group that turns both switches on, or you could swap your SwitchLinc and ICON switches, so that the SwitchLinc is the primary. Since the ICON doesn't have a LED ramp, you won't need the duplicate action.

Patrick: Sounds like you have what you are calling primary/secondary switches backwards -- the primary switch is the one controlling the load. If you have Indigo tell the switch with the load to turn on/off, then it will. But if you tell Indigo to command a secondary switch to turn the load on/off, then the switch will adjust LED ramp but the messages never makes it to the primary switch so the load won't be controlled.

I'm thinking about a way to fix this in a future version so that the user doesn't have to try to keep these manually in-sync...

Regards,
Matt

Matt: How would you do this with a keypadlinc that is a non-primary switch? If I'm understanding this correctly, I have a dimmer with a load on it, a second dimmer with no load which is linked to the loaded dimmer, and a keypadlinc that is controlling a different light but which has one of the extra buttons setup for the loaded dimmer light. If I add the 2nd dimmer (no load) to the software I should be able to create an action group to turn both switches on/off correct? How would I control the state on the "C" button on the keypadlinc?

- Jeff

[matt (support)]

Hi Jeff,

Indigo can only control the KeypadLinc LED for the main load. We hope to address this in a future version as well.

Regards,
Matt

Hi Matt -

In reply to my question regarding a 3-way circuit containing an ICON Dimmer and a SwitchLinc V2, you stated that one of my options to make the SwitchLinc V2 LEDs to show the actual status of the circuit when "turned on" by Indigo controlling the ICON Dimmer (LEDs ramped up) was as follows:

"This means when you tell the primary switch (the one with the load attached) to turn on, the secondary switch doesn't know to update its LED ramp. You have a couple of options: you could create an Action Group that turns both switches on ..."

I do not understand how to create such an "Action Group". Can you provide me some guidance?

Thanks,

Skip

[matt (support)]

Hi Skip,

You would create a new Action Group and have two duplicate Send Device Actions, for example to Set Brightness to 75%. The first action would set the brightness of the ICON dimmer, so the light comes on immediately. The second action would set the brightness of the SwitchLinc dimmer. Now the SwitchLinc dimmer LED ramp will match the ICON dimmer state. You will have to create an Action Group for every dimmer state possibility you have (on, off, and the different brightness levels Indigo commands the dimmers to).

Lastly, your Trigger or Time/Date Action will do the Execute Action Group action instead of the Send Device Action.

I'm planning on fixing all the above here eventually so you don't have to jump through these hoops. But it may be a few weeks.

Regards,
Matt

Thanks a bunch, Matt ... I'll give it a try!

I'm planning on fixing all the above here eventually so you don't have to jump through these hoops. But it may be a few weeks.

Did anything happen with this? The problem of keeping secondaries in sync with their primary is the biggest problem with Indigo/Insteon for me. I don't know of a practical way to do it.

[matt (support)]

Did anything happen with this? The problem of keeping secondaries in sync with their primary is the biggest problem with Indigo/Insteon for me. I don't know of a practical way to do it.

This, which is very similar to the KeypadLinc LED problem, will be addressed when INSTEON link management is added to Indigo. I had hoped to get that into 2.0, but it won't happen until 2.1 / 2.5. It is high priority though.

Regards,
Matt

There's two possibilities for this setup, one of them works fine...it's just when Indigo gets involved that you have a problem. (No offense...I LOVE INDIGO!!)

1 - Person taps the one switch, the other is updated by insteon link: This one works just fine.

Now the problem:
2 - Indigo sends a command to one switch, the other is not updated

You can either fix the problem by having Indigo send a command to both switches every time, or there's the solution I've been working with.

I created two Insteon devices in Indigo calling them Master & Slave. In my various scripts I only address Master. I then created a trigger action that runs whenever the brightness of Master changes. It runs this simple applescript.

Code: Select all

set masterState to brightness of device "Hallway - Overhead (master)"
set slaveState to brightness of device "Hallway - Overhead (slave)"

if not (masterState = slaveState) then
    set brightness of device "Hallway - Overhead (slave)" to masterState
end if


Works for me!

[matt (support)]

Thanks for sharing -- that is the lowest overhead approach I've seen!

Matt

...I created two Insteon devices in Indigo calling them Master & Slave. In my various scripts I only address Master. I then created a trigger action that runs whenever the brightness of Master changes. It runs this simple applescript...

That's very interesting. I'm going to change to using that.

While trying it for a relay, I found that there is no unqualified "Device State Changed" available, since choosing "Different Brightness Level" excludes relays from the Device popup list. I think that this is a bug, or at least, a misfeature.

I was pleasantly surprised to find that I could enter embedded applescripts from a remote client. I assumed that I had to do that on the server, but it works on the client. Very convenient.

...It runs this simple applescript...

I have found that when I change a light from the secondary, the script does not see the new secondary value before it runs. I get logging like this:

Received INSTEON "Dining Room Secondary" on
Trigger Action Dining Room Changed
Sent INSTEON "Dining Room Secondary" on to 100

Any idea why this happens, and if it's possible to avoid?

Thanks.

[matt (support)]

...It runs this simple applescript...

I have found that when I change a light from the secondary, the script does not see the new secondary value before it runs.

Based on your log snippet I'm not quite following what is going on. What were you expecting to see?

Regards,
Matt