Pioneers, Part II

Posted on
Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:58 pm
Aeolius offline
Posts: 118
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Location: Summerfield, NC

Pioneers, Part II

In my quest for a home automation solution that integrates with a Macintosh home network, I called several home automation companies in my area. Most replied with the typical "appliance salesman" response, offering an embedded Crestron + Lutron solution. Another specialized solely in HAI systems. None seemed to offer the "Think Different" approach that I was looking for.

I began to wonder how far a Mac home network would actually go, towards providing my solution. A member on the Indigo message board introduced me to the Xenarc line of touchscreen monitors, which, when coupled with a Mac Mini would provide a pretty slick interface, to the tune of $870. For comparison, an HAI OmniTouch controller with video is $900.

With a Mac, I can use Indigo and SecuritySpy. Both have widgets, are web accessible, and have intuitive interfaces. Hopefully they will seamlessly integrate with the Intel-based Macs. That's a pretty good start. With a host of touchscreen Mac Minis networked with typical Mac workstations, a shared audio solution and home intercom is achieved. A DVD/movie server like Kaleidescape would provide a shared movie solution. I wonder if iTunes will ever allow for video sharing, or if Front Row can handle a DVD server. Assuming that I begin with two network surveillance cameras, one indoor and one outdoors, then add a dozen more over time, am I going to need an Xserve or two, to handle Indigo, SecuritySpy, and a DVD server? Will I need OS X Server to manage a WiFi hotspot, such as the one provided with the D-Link DWL-2700AP?

Granted, there are plenty of pieces of the puzzle that I have no idea how to approach; HVAC, security/motion alarms, water sensors and so on. I also foresee several projects; integrating a weather station, aquarium control by coupling a Labjack with Maquarium, and automatically feeding animals by coupling a Labjack with a ProFeeder. How much structured wiring will I need? How do in integrate it all? How do I keep this project scalable, affordable, and manageable? How does the HAI approach compare against Insteon?

I also want this home to be accessible for my son, who uses a wheelchair. The placement of automatic door openers, such as those offered by Open Sesame, will be integrated into the home design. Is there any chance of utilizing OS X's native speech recognition, during the design of the home automation system?

And then there is the waiting game. The January MacWorld Expo in San Francisco did not debut a DVR solution from Apple, as was anticipated, but the new Intel-based iMacs and MacBooks were released. TiVo didn't offer tangible evidence, beyond the presence of a prototype, of their Series 3 DVR at NEC. Apple has committed to updating their entire line to Intel processors by the end of 2006. If I set up a network of Mac Minis and Xserves, will new ones be released before my home is completed?

I know I can't do all of this myself. I lack the time and the knowledge to properly wire the system, concoct appropriate AppleScript/Automator routines, devise widgets, and troubleshoot. I have had one competent response on the Indigo message-boards, albeit from someone living on the other side of the US, and one response from a company 2 hours away. I feel overwhelmed by the scope of the project, but look forward to a "MacHouse Pro" that I can showcase with pride.

Posted on
Wed Jan 11, 2006 6:52 pm
jeremyh offline
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Joined: Apr 21, 2004
Location: Bellevue, WA

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For what it's worth, I think you've definitely got a good handle on the kinds of things you'd like to handle.

From my perspective, your approach offers the most flexibility. But, (and I can't believe I'm saying this), with such an open and flexible system ala Linux, you've got several open ends that either you need to tie up (such as write attachment scripts for) or someone else needs to provide a solution for you. Systems that are integrated ala HAI offer the easiest install and ongoing ease-of-use but are a) expensive and b) not as flexible. With everything else that you want to do, I think going with the Mac will offer the best bang for the buck.

I'm a firm believer that the Mac mini offers the best bang for the buck for controlling nearly everything in your home. I wouldn't worry too much about processing power, through. No need for an Xserve just yet. I run Indigo, SecuritySpy (with 12 cameras- some over the Internet) and the Hubbell.biz web site all from an old Cube that was upgraded to 1.5Gb of RAM and 1Ghz processor. The machine runs OS X Server without a hitch 24/7. That's not to say I wouldn't LOVE to have an Xserve running the show, but it doesn't appear to be necessary at the moment. Oh, and I also have all of my, ahem, acquired TV shows streaming to other Macs in the house from this machine. Now if you look further down the road with PVR/DVR and video server functions, then more horsepower may be needed- especially when things go HD.

I know your frustration regarding dealing with home automation sales. One of the reasons I got into this whole business is because I noticed a void in people who really knew their stuff. Oh, sure, there's home theater specialists getting into things like HAI and Lutron (et. al.), but it's just one small piece of the puzzle in their mind. In my mind, and I think several others in the forums share this, the PC (in our case, the Mac) is the main control for the entire home. Think of it as our home's CPU. From media, to security, to climate control, and beyond. I *think* Apple is headed that way. (How many predictions did you see for a Mac mini DVR at this years MWSF?) However, I don't feel they'll extend much beyond entertainment and certainly not beyond mass entertainment. Home automation is a viable business, but it's not for the faint of heart. Every home is different and every homeowner has different needs. It's VERY difficult to apply generalized solutions across the board- hence the reason that I think Apple will never put Matt out of business. :)

I wish you the best of luck with your MacHouse Pro project. Right now, it's a daunting task, but without folks like us pushing the envelope, it'll never make it into the mainstream (meaning high Spouse Approval Factor). :)

-------------------------------------------------
Jeremy Hubbell - Hubbell Automation
http://www.hubbell.biz
-------------------------------------------------

Posted on
Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:27 pm
Threadhead offline
Posts: 53
Joined: Oct 16, 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ

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I think there is just one piece of the puzzle missing that would make Mac HA just soar, that and that is an outstanding web interface. Like Cinemar's MainLobby. If you haven't seen it, it's very, very elegant and simple to setup. And there are MANY modules for controlling a wealth of other systems (audio, security, video, dvd, and on). And setting up touchscreen access is just too simple, and looks very professional.

Yes, I know there is a PHP access/control for Indigo, but it is no where near as configurable and extensible or easy as MainLobby. And this is not a put-down of what Andy Turner has done with the web PHP interface. He has done a lot of hard work. But the visuals and graphics just aren't there. Take a look at MainLobby and you'll see what I mean.

Hopefully, some day, it will all come together. I so much want to see Macs take a leading role in HA.

Posted on
Thu Jan 12, 2006 5:32 pm
matt (support) offline
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I'm not that familiar with MainLobby, but it doesn't look like it provides that UI via the browser. It is client/server, but I'm not sure the client is the browser. But I don't know... I've never played with the app before.

Threadhead wrote:
...and that is an outstanding web interface.


Stay tuned... :-)

Regards,
Matt

Posted on
Thu Jan 12, 2006 7:24 pm
Threadhead offline
Posts: 53
Joined: Oct 16, 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ

(No subject)

support wrote:
I'm not that familiar with MainLobby, but it doesn't look like it provides that UI via the browser. It is client/server, but I'm not sure the client is the browser. But I don't know... I've never played with the app before.

Matt, you are correct it uses a server/client configuration. I should have been clearer about that. But you just buy the server and connect with as many clients as you wish.

I was referring to ML as more of an example of a nice control interface that is very easy to setup, but I think it should be web based.
Stay tuned... :-)

Hmm, I wonder what you may have up your sleeve :shock:

Posted on
Fri Jan 13, 2006 10:41 am
Aeolius offline
Posts: 118
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Location: Summerfield, NC

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I just had a meeting with a local home automation company. I had met with them once before and had given them a set of blueprints to work with. In their proposal, they included two touch panels; one wireless, one wired. Not to impugn the nature of their work, I was nevertheless unprepared to see a total in excess of $14,000 for them. The wireless setup was over $10,500, including a docking station, while the wired unit was nearly $4,000. How many Mac Minis with touch-panels can I get for that, I wondered (now in a holding pattern for the Intel Mac Minis/Mac DVRs)? And I think a PowerBook (pardon me; a MacBook Pro) would suffice as a wireless touch panel, once properly retrofitted.

Posted on
Fri Jan 13, 2006 10:53 am
ajturner offline
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Joined: Jul 10, 2005
Location: Washington, DC

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Well, most of the cost I assume is labor on their part. Like getting your car worked on where the part costs $400, but the whole bill is > $2,000.

Each of the parts can be purchased for much less (e.g. MacMinis, PocketPC w/ wifi, etc) it's the integration head-aches and programming that will eat most of the cost/time.

So, for DIY, you'll say TONS of money, no doubt. However, you may estrange your family/loved-ones as you lock yourself in your workshop putting it all together and strewn about your house. ;)

I personally, have chosen the latter, as I enjoy personal frustration and aggrevation of my own devising. But I can also see where a HomeAutomation company would have to (could) charge a lot.

In addition, your own solution (not using a pre-packaged HAI controller) allows you for much more fun in customization/modification/hacking.

Control Indigo from anywhere in the world:
http://highearthorbit.com/software/indigowidget

Posted on
Fri Jan 13, 2006 2:36 pm
Aeolius offline
Posts: 118
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Location: Summerfield, NC

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ajturner wrote:
Well, most of the cost I assume is labor on their part... the integration head-aches and programming that will eat most of the cost/time.


Labor and programming were broken out seperately.

Posted on
Sun Jan 15, 2006 2:48 am
Alexander offline
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Joined: Sep 06, 2005

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Wow, $14k for two touchpanels, no programming? There's some serious profit margin there.

I absolutely echo some of the other comments in this thread--if you're not willing to do your own design, setup, and maintenance, be prepared to spend some serious coin. The actual hardware may be only moderately expensive, but there's a SERIOUS amount of effort required to get so many different components talking to each other correctly, and configured the way you want them, to boot.

I wouldn't be focused on the Intel Macs so much; they do not offer anything inherently better for this kind of application. The only thing that may be on the horizon that is exciting for this kind of project is the Mac Plasma / DVR rumors. In fact, for HA "guts", I would strongly suggest avoiding Intel Macs for now, because you're probably going to need to get a lot of kexts working on the server machine(s), and those are very much not functional on Intel at this time.

Indigo, and its AppleScript integration in particular, continue to impress me. If you can get the data you want into your Mac, Indigo and AppleScript will let you do what you want with it.

Posted on
Thu Jan 19, 2006 5:55 pm
Aeolius offline
Posts: 118
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Location: Summerfield, NC

update

Things seem to be progressing quite rapidly, now.

The bad news is that the builder had already contracted out with a local security company, for the installation of a home alarm system. The good news is that they are installing an Ademco (now Honeywell) system, with my choice of control panels. I have read on the Indigo boards and over at shed.com that certain Ademco systems support X-10, so with luck I'll be able to tie the alarms and sensors into Indigo.

The bad news is that the builder had already contracted out with a local company, to run phone lines, coax cable, ceiling speakers, and a central vacuum system. The good news is that I hate central vacuum systems; so I can apply that portion of the allocated budget (and some money from not finishing a basement bathroom) towards having the same company run some CAT6 and bundled cabling throughout the house. I might have the ceiling speakers tie into a series of Airport Express modules, as well.

The bad news is that the electrician has already installed the wiring and boxes for switches and outlets. The good news is that he hasn't placed the switches, yet, so I can reduce his order and place a load of SwitchLincs in there. Granted, his initial bid was for 58 single switches, 45 three-way switches, and 9 four-way switches. I'm not sure how many we ended up with.

The bad news is that a local home automation company wanted $3,800, for a 7" widescreen touchscreen interface; part of a complete system totaling more than $70,000. The good news is that a Mac Mini coupled with a Xenarc touchscreen will set me back less than $900 (and passes the Spouse Approval Factor when coupled with the backlit Mini mount).

I have spoken with a representative from a home automation company, who also frequents the Indigo boards. In a few days, I am also meeting with a local home automation company (hopefully not one that wants $70K+) that seems to think outside the box.

Feel free to look over the house plans, at http://www.aeolius.com/house/ , and let me know what your thoughts are. I'll post updated pictures and video in a week, or so, and plan to start a podcast/blog (via iLife '06) pertaining to my home automation exploits.

Posted on
Thu Jan 19, 2006 6:23 pm
yroca23 offline

Speaking of Alarms...

Your statement about Ademco alarms (Honeywell) caught my attention as I have the Vista 15-P. I know it has x-10 capabilities, but I don't know much more than that. Anyone have a good resource for tieing an alarm like this into Indigo. I have wired sensors on all doors and windows and wouldn't mind have these in Indigo.

Posted on
Mon Jan 23, 2006 7:33 pm
Aeolius offline
Posts: 118
Joined: Oct 28, 2004
Location: Summerfield, NC

(No subject)

Playing with an iLife '06 blog

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